NY Times Article on Books & Video Games

[lgw]

Hi everybody,

The New York Times ran an article today about "Using Video Games as Bait to Hook Readers". Here are the links to the article and to the comment so far:

Article: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/06/books/06games.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=haarsma&st=cse&oref=slogin

Comments: http://community.nytimes.com/article/comments/2008/10/06/books/06games.html

So, what's your reaction? What do you think? Don't let them forget about the Card Soldier Wars!

All the best,

Frank

[homburgmolly_fan]

Hi everybody,

The New York Times ran an article today about "Using Video Games as Bait to Hook Readers". Here are the links to the article and to the comment so far:

Article: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/06/books/06games.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=haarsma&st=cse&oref=slogin

Comments: http://community.nytimes.com/article/comments/2008/10/06/books/06games.html

So, what's your reaction? What do you think? Don't let them forget about the Card Soldier Wars!

All the best,

Frank

Well, to be honest, I can see where that might be true and where it might not be true. For example, if I were to play a video game that I really liked and then find out that there was a book of it, I would surely read the book, too. But I guess it doesn't really count for me to say that because I would rather read than play video games, anyways!

But, Frank, your books honestly don't need all that stuff. I mean, thank goodness you've got all the supplemental stuff on the website and in the books (such as Hatter M and Princess Alyss of Wonderland) because that keeps all of us wild fans happy, but your books are so DROP DEAD AMAZING that they can survive without anything! You're an awesome author!

[bellabong95]

Well, to be honest, I can see where that might be true and where it might not be true. For example, if I were to play a video game that I really liked and then find out that there was a book of it, I would surely read the book, too. But I guess it doesn't really count for me to say that because I would rather read than play video games, anyways!

But, Frank, your books honestly don't need all that stuff. I mean, thank goodness you've got all the supplemental stuff on the website and in the books (such as Hatter M and Princess Alyss of Wonderland) because that keeps all of us wild fans happy, but your books are so DROP DEAD AMAZING that they can survive without anything! You're an awesome author!

Yes, it makes sense, I suppose if I didn't know about the book and played the video game I would definately want to read the book, but I agree that your books alone are sooooooo amazing. I'd read them even if there wasn't all this stuff to tide us over until the next book! Your books are definately worth the wait!

[grdonathan]

Though, I think it's really hard for people like us to truly grasp the concept of children now a days not liking books the way we do. So they've had to lure children into reading by using the vicious pull video games have on children today.

Instead of a parent giving their child a good book anymore, that's considered 'lame' to most kids. They want Playstation and X-box...the more mind numbing the game the better. And they wonder why grades are going down, why illiteracy is becoming more and more common...?

I think that this is a great idea for the TIMES that we're in. If we can't get a kid to read a book on the book's merit alone...it's not necessarily the author's fault. In most cases it isn't their fault at ALL, it's merely the conditioning the child has grown up in. So why not lure a child back to books by giving them a little of what they find 'socially acceptable' in order to get them to stop caring about how many coins are in the next level and worrying a little more about learning to spell it 'thanks' not 'thx'?

[homburgmolly_fan]

Though, I think it's really hard for people like us to truly grasp the concept of children now a days not liking books the way we do. So they've had to lure children into reading by using the vicious pull video games have on children today.



Yes, and I think it's actually a good idea. You're right, we don't know exactly how that is because we see books -such as LGW- just sitting on the shelves at bookstores and we are falling over each other to grab them and read them. Whereas most kids would rather just sit and play videogames and not even set foot into a bookstore at all. So for the videogames, computer games, and TV to be bringing the stories of these books into the world of the videogamer... it's a good start.

[grdonathan]

Especially when you link the two to a point where the child needs to read the book.

[bellabong95]

Oh so true! Not everyone is as big of a bookworm as I am/we are! :) I think it's terrible that the kids these days think it's "uncool" to read books. I honestly don't understand their logic on that one. I think it's because they associate books with school and they automatically "hate" school just because it's full of learning. Now it's starting even earlier as well, I know a couple five year olds that live around my complex that already dislike school and reading. They've only been in school for a month!

[homburgmolly_fan]

Oh so true! Not everyone is as big of a bookworm as I am/we are! :) I think it's terrible that the kids these days think it's "uncool" to read books. I honestly don't understand their logic on that one. I think it's because they associate books with school and they automatically "hate" school just because it's full of learning. Now it's starting even earlier as well, I know a couple five year olds that live around my complex that already dislike school and reading. They've only been in school for a month!

I don't know what it is, but being "cool" probably has something to do with it. And lately, when all these fancy new playstation sets and all that are coming out, it seems that all this flashy, shiny electronic stuff is being waved around in our faces and books have quietly taken a back seat. So kids automatically assume that they have to do what is popular in order to be cool, and what can be more popular than the shiny junk being shown on TV 24/7?

That's why I'm also REALLY glad that they're doing all these movie adaptions of great books. Such as Lord of the Rings and Narnia. Also that Eragon series.

I think LGW will be a good thing for potential readers because, you know, the Eragon book is so huge, the LOTR books are so advanced, and the Narnia books are slightly kiddish so all these factors might scare away potential readers.

LGW is just right. It isn't too long, too short, too advanced, or too kiddish for the tween/teen reader who's just begun taking an interest in books.

Hopefully it will add more recruits to the bookworm army! :D

[bellabong95]

I agree!! :D

[homburgmolly_fan]

I agree!! :D

Yay for LGW! :)

[ReadingChick]

I don't know what it is, but being "cool" probably has something to do with it. And lately, when all these fancy new playstation sets and all that are coming out, it seems that all this flashy, shiny electronic stuff is being waved around in our faces and books have quietly taken a back seat. So kids automatically assume that they have to do what is popular in order to be cool, and what can be more popular than the shiny junk being shown on TV 24/7?

I've kept silent until now, but I feel the need to speak up. Video games aren't just about being popular - in fact, I've yet to meet a person who played a video game just because it's the 'cool' thing to do. Serious gamers are shunned almost as much as bookworms around here.

I play a lot of video games, and I can tell you now that there are some series' that tell stories that simply wouldn't be possible in a book or in a movie. The Final Fantasy series, for instance, is known for its epic worlds and stories - and in a way it has the advantage of the book in that you as the player character are actually a part of the world. Not everyone has the necessary imagination to imagine themselves into a book. Sad, but true.

It is sad that there are less kids reading these days, but it's a product of the society we live in. And you have to blame the TV before you blame the game consoles - because it's the TVs that started showing us everything in visual form. Before the invention of the television, you read a newspaper to find out what was going on. Now you watch the news. Things have changed. That's a fact.

And seriously, do you think that LGW will stop at a book and a movie? I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a game, too. I'd be interested in seeing how that turned out, actually.

Anyway, I'll pull my head in now.

[homburgmolly_fan]

I've kept silent until now, but I feel the need to speak up. Video games aren't just about being popular - in fact, I've yet to meet a person who played a video game just because it's the 'cool' thing to do. Serious gamers are shunned almost as much as bookworms around here.

I play a lot of video games, and I can tell you now that there are some series' that tell stories that simply wouldn't be possible in a book or in a movie. The Final Fantasy series, for instance, is known for its epic worlds and stories - and in a way it has the advantage of the book in that you as the player character are actually a part of the world. Not everyone has the necessary imagination to imagine themselves into a book. Sad, but true.

It is sad that there are less kids reading these days, but it's a product of the society we live in. And you have to blame the TV before you blame the game consoles - because it's the TVs that started showing us everything in visual form. Before the invention of the television, you read a newspaper to find out what was going on. Now you watch the news. Things have changed. That's a fact.

And seriously, do you think that LGW will stop at a book and a movie? I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a game, too. I'd be interested in seeing how that turned out, actually.

Anyway, I'll pull my head in now.

Please don't get me wrong: I'm not condeming video games.

I play them all the time, and also watch a ton of TV, but I would still rather read. But come on, you have to admit that peer pressure has at least something to do with the lack of reading among younger kids these days. And you're right in the way that the TV is just as much to blame as the game consoles.

I believe that anything that can be made into a videogame can be made into some other form of entertainment, be it movie or book. They might not be exactly the same, but they can tell the same story. Maybe I'm wrong on this, but if a book is made after a video game, the people who play the video game might read it and even if it's not so great, at least they'll be reading, so it's worth it.

All I'm saying is that I still believe that the amount of peer pressure/video games/TV that is being thrown at kids nowadays probably has something to do with the lack of reading nowadays. I think that video games/TV should be limited and not constant, and books more encouraged.

But trust me, if a LGW videogame comes out -which it probably will- I am going to be the VERY FIRST ONE to play it! I am looking forward to it. You just won't see me burning my bookshelf and investing in a brand new X-Box 360 instead.

When I'm up real late at night I won't be battling Redd on the videogame... I'll be reading through "Seeing Redd" as I've done a thousand times before and will undoubtably do a thousand times more.
:) That puts me into happy mode! :)

[bellabong95]

yea i agree with you readingchick! lol I LOVEEEE video games! haha I didn't mean that playing video games was "cool", (although it is to me) I meant that people think reading is uncool... because i think they relate it to schoolwork, it's just an idea and i could definately be wrong. i was just putting in a thought. I myself am in school still and i was just thinking back on the things my peers have said.

[grdonathan]

I've kept silent until now, but I feel the need to speak up. Video games aren't just about being popular - in fact, I've yet to meet a person who played a video game just because it's the 'cool' thing to do. Serious gamers are shunned almost as much as bookworms around here.

I play a lot of video games, and I can tell you now that there are some series' that tell stories that simply wouldn't be possible in a book or in a movie. The Final Fantasy series, for instance, is known for its epic worlds and stories - and in a way it has the advantage of the book in that you as the player character are actually a part of the world. Not everyone has the necessary imagination to imagine themselves into a book. Sad, but true.

It is sad that there are less kids reading these days, but it's a product of the society we live in. And you have to blame the TV before you blame the game consoles - because it's the TVs that started showing us everything in visual form. Before the invention of the television, you read a newspaper to find out what was going on. Now you watch the news. Things have changed. That's a fact.

And seriously, do you think that LGW will stop at a book and a movie? I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a game, too. I'd be interested in seeing how that turned out, actually.

Anyway, I'll pull my head in now.

Yeah...I have to say don't get me wrong too. I know that television is the original drain on society these days. I'm just saying that video games ARE a part of it as well. It's just that, thanks to tv and video games, kids now a days don't even BOTHER to develop their imaginations because it's handed to them in the form of games and movies.

My baby sister...well she's 12 now, hardly a baby, but she's a HUGE example of this. She LOVES the Harry Potter movies, LOTR, Narnia, Eragon...etc, but never ONCE has she picked up the books and read them. "I already know what they're about," she says. "Why bother reading them?"

I've told her how different books are from movies, how much richer of an experience they are, how much the movie has to leave out in order to reach that magical time limit.

She doesn't care.

She'd rather watch movies, play games, watch TV. I even tried to PAY her to read the Harry Potter books...to no avail. You know why...? Because she was playing the games...she figured it was the same thing. More content in a game huh? As apposed to a movie...yes, but it's DIFFERENT content. Harry never rides his broom around the castle collecting coins or whatever the heck he's collecting.

She doesn't care.

"None of my friends have bothered reading them either, why should I?" I dunno...so you're not as dull as a doorknob when you grow up? I love my sister dearly, but she's frighteningly illiterate for a 12 year old child. I was reading high school level books at her age and she still can't read aloud to me from Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe without stumbling and bumbling her way through it. And why is that?

She doesn't care.

So no...I'm not laying the blame solely on consoles. They provide a legitimate source of entertainment that no one here is going to deny. And yes, TV has had a MAJOR hand in that...as well as movies. My point is, in GENERAL, that all of them together have effectively stultified the youth of today.


Please don't get me wrong: I'm not condeming video games.

All I'm saying is that I still believe that the amount of peer pressure/video games/TV that is being thrown at kids nowadays probably has something to do with the lack of reading nowadays. I think that video games/TV should be limited and not constant, and books more encouraged.

But trust me, if a LGW videogame comes out -which it probably will- I am going to be the VERY FIRST ONE to play it! I am looking forward to it. You just won't see me burning my bookshelf and investing in a brand new X-Box 360 instead.

You made several good points here. I think a lot of it DOES need to rest on the parents. When I was growing up, I was given books...not games. Oh sure, I had a few games here and there, only since I've moved out of the house have I become a SERIOUS gamer, but books were raised above others when I was growing up.

Some of you might ask...then why did that happen to your sister? Well, my mother didn't raise me. My grandparents did...yes, which leads back to 'they were raised in a time before TVs. My grandparents didn't have TV's till after they were married. So yes, I was raised in a household with different values.

Now a days, MOST parents just want something that will keep the child occupied and out of their hair. A video game does this FAR better than a book when you're not raised with them. God forbid a parent take time to sit and READ with their child! No, no...I'll just spend the money for the games and they don't have to ask me how to say this word or that. Who cares if, when their 12, they still don't know the difference between they're, there and their? (Yes, my sister doesn't know that....)

It's true, we'll probably ALL buy the game...how could we NOT? But like you said, we won't be selling our books to do it.

[bellabong95]

Such a good point!! I was one of those rare kids that did it on my own. I actually enjoyed reading from the start. my mother was a medical biller so she did a lot of stuff on the computor but I was still i nto books. Although she wasn;t a big reader herself she encouraged me when I read well to her! She actually read the first harry potter book with me, well part of it, and then I finished it. And I agree that there is such a more vivid description in books for me. Another part of it is probably because I have a really good imagination. When I read a book I read so fast that it's like I'm not even reading anymore, it's like I'm watching a movie and the book turns into a movie screen. I wish that more kids would just TRY to do this it makes reading so much more... fulfilling. I was reading at a tenth grade level in 4th grade, and other kids could do this too if they only...
cared.

[homburgmolly_fan]

Such a good point!! I was one of those rare kids that did it on my own. I actually enjoyed reading from the start.

And I agree that there is such a more vivid description in books for me. Another part of it is probably because I have a really good imagination. When I read a book I read so fast that it's like I'm not even reading anymore, it's like I'm watching a movie and the book turns into a movie screen. I wish that more kids would just TRY to do this it makes reading so much more... fulfilling.

This is like reading a review of how my brain works on books.

I barely even see the words on the page when I am reading. It really is like a movie for me. I don't know how that came about... I think it was just from years of reading and imagining. I was always encouraged to read, even if it was just the same old book over and over. In fact, I've begun collecting all of my favorite childhood books because, when I read them, it still holds some of that magic that they had when I first picked them up and read them. I would go over them again and again until I practically had them memorized... but I still loved them; never got bored of my books. It was because my mind turned them more like into real-life experiences or friends rather than reading.

I am glad of this because that definitely helped to expand my imagination. Now, I don't know what I'd do without it. Like I said before, I still like video games and TV -actually, to be honest, I love them- but they simply cannot replace my imagination. For example, one time my brothers got a new video game, and I saw one of the characters who was supposed to be a prince or something. Awhile into the game I got bored of it but I went off and created a whole other world and story inspired by this character... eventually it became my next book. I can't imagine a lot of the kids nowadays doing stuff like that. They see what is on the screen before them and don't care about the endless possibilities... the worlds, heroes, and adventures you can make all by yourself if only you let your mind roam.

So I'm not saying that everyone needs to write a book every time they play a new video game or watch a new movie. I just wish that they would think beyond what they see on the screen; that they would give imagination a chance.

That was one of the things that made me fall in love with the LGW series. Nowadays everyone links "Imagination" with "Childish". Frank Beddor has presented us with a different view: simply, that a little imagination, when used well, can make the world a better place.

[grdonathan]

Such a good point!! I was one of those rare kids that did it on my own. I actually enjoyed reading from the start. my mother was a medical biller so she did a lot of stuff on the computor but I was still i nto books. Although she wasn;t a big reader herself she encouraged me when I read well to her! She actually read the first harry potter book with me, well part of it, and then I finished it. And I agree that there is such a more vivid description in books for me. Another part of it is probably because I have a really good imagination. When I read a book I read so fast that it's like I'm not even reading anymore, it's like I'm watching a movie and the book turns into a movie screen. I wish that more kids would just TRY to do this it makes reading so much more... fulfilling. I was reading at a tenth grade level in 4th grade, and other kids could do this too if they only...


This is like reading a review of how my brain works on books.

I barely even see the words on the page when I am reading. It really is like a movie for me. I don't know how that came about... I think it was just from years of reading and imagining. I was always encouraged to read, even if it was just the same old book over and over. In fact, I've begun collecting all of my favorite childhood books because, when I read them, it still holds some of that magic that they had when I first picked them up and read them. I would go over them again and again until I practically had them memorized... but I still loved them; never got bored of my books. It was because my mind turned them more like into real-life experiences or friends rather than reading.

I am glad of this because that definitely helped to expand my imagination. Now, I don't know what I'd do without it. Like I said before, I still like video games and TV -actually, to be honest, I love them- but they simply cannot replace my imagination. For example, one time my brothers got a new video game, and I saw one of the characters who was supposed to be a prince or something. Awhile into the game I got bored of it but I went off and created a whole other world and story inspired by this character... eventually it became my next book. I can't imagine a lot of the kids nowadays doing stuff like that. They see what is on the screen before them and don't care about the endless possibilities... the worlds, heroes, and adventures you can make all by yourself if only you let your mind roam.

So I'm not saying that everyone needs to write a book every time they play a new video game or watch a new movie. I just wish that they would think beyond what they see on the screen; that they would give imagination a chance.

That was one of the things that made me fall in love with the LGW series. Nowadays everyone links "Imagination" with "Childish". Frank Beddor has presented us with a different view: simply, that a little imagination, when used well, can make the world a better place.

EXACTLY Thank you ladies, couldn't have said it better myself!

[homburgmolly_fan]

EXACTLY Thank you ladies, couldn't have said it better myself!

I am glad we all seem to agree on this stuff! And I am VERY glad to hear that I am not the only one for whom books are like movies, and who has such a large imagination that people will actually tell me "You have a very big imagination". LOL I had begun to think that maybe I was alone on this stuff! :eek:

[grdonathan]

I am glad we all seem to agree on this stuff! And I am VERY glad to hear that I am not the only one for whom books are like movies, and who has such a large imagination that people will actually tell me "You have a very big imagination". LOL I had begun to think that maybe I was alone on this stuff! :eek:

Not one little bit. My imagination is crazy active. My husband teases me when I tell him about my dreams too because they're always so intricate, like I'm watching a movie and yet taking part in it as well. I feel like the director, but it's way fun.

It's the same with books...I read them and see them. Imagination is a wonderful thing and I hate it when people say they 'don't have an imagination'. Of COURSE you do...it's just like any other muscle in your body though, if you don't use it, exercise it...it'll shrivel up into uselessness until you do.

[homburgmolly_fan]

Imagination is a wonderful thing and I hate it when people say they 'don't have an imagination'. Of COURSE you do...it's just like any other muscle in your body though, if you don't use it, exercise it...it'll shrivel up into uselessness until you do.

I'll tell you what this world needs... we need an army of Bibwits to come and teach people about their imaginations. :D

[grdonathan]

I'll tell you what this world needs... we need an army of Bibwits to come and teach people about their imaginations. :D

Oh...if only!!

[Ember]

There ought to be a profession for teachers of imagination. That would be so cool. *sighing as I dream of the posssiblities* Ah!